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Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:55 am
by Xian Nox
m0skit0 wrote:Xian Nox wrote:From the point you bought it, it becomes yours and nobody has the right to claim any portion of it for himself
Wrong. The closed-source software it includes does not belong to you (of course this depends on the software license).
Yes, you only have the license to use the software so you cannot change it. What I meant was you own the hardware and you are free to use it in any way you want. This means you can install another operating system for example.
Now it occurs to me that it is legal to change a PS3's firmware in Europe, but it's illegal to do it in the USA.
m0skit0 wrote:Xian Nox wrote:A key logger is considered a program, so unless the person asks whether or not there is a key logger, you don't have to tell, as you don't have to list all the programs installed on the computer.
Wrong. This depends on legal consideration for each country, but as a general rule for occidental countries, if you're offering that computer as a public service (either paying or for free, doesn't matter), you should inform for any private data gathering. Same goes for supermarkets or underground, where camera watching is informed ("you're being filmed" ...). Also you'll have to delete those users data passed a certain amount of time (which varies for each country). Also you have to set up a service for users being able to see what data you've gathered from them and they can also request you to erase it (this also could change from country to country). As I said, this only applies for a public service, not for private use.
I see. If it is a public service you should inform the users of all private data gathering.
If it is private (you lend your computer to somebody), would the same rules apply?
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:08 pm
by m0skit0
Xian Nox wrote:Yes, you only have the license to use the software so you cannot change it. What I meant was you own the hardware and you are free to use it in any way you want. This means you can install another operating system for example.
Wrong as well. You cannot use the hardware in any way you want. You cannot RE it and make a copy, for example. You cannot modify it and re-sell it. There is a long list of (IMHO stupid) restrictions.
Xian Nox wrote:Now it occurs to me that it is legal to change a PS3's firmware in Europe, but it's illegal to do it in the USA.
That's software, and also PS3 is a closed system. You cannot actually modify anything in it. Also in USA lately there's a big crusade against civil rights where big corporations are the leading spear.
Xian Nox wrote:If it is private (you lend your computer to somebody), would the same rules apply?
Not as long as you don't make illegal use of any private data gathered this way (or any other way
).
IMHO all this laws actually are wrong: you hinder creativity and people's curiosity, which only causes people to be more stupid and have less knowledge. Bad for people but dang good for diactatorship means.
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:13 pm
by Xian Nox
m0skit0 wrote:Wrong as well. You cannot use the hardware in any way you want. You cannot RE it and make a copy, for example. You cannot modify it and re-sell it. There is a long list of (IMHO stupid) restrictions.
Does this mean I cannot sell a computer if I have changed the hard drive for example? Or if I can't sell it if I have physically modified the hard drive?
m0skit0 wrote:Not as long as you don't make illegal use of any private data gathered this way (or any other way
).
Basically it's OK as long as the "victim" doesn't find out it's me.
m0skit0 wrote:IMHO all this laws actually are wrong: you hinder creativity and people's curiosity, which only causes people to be more stupid and have less knowledge. Bad for people but dang good for dictatorship means.
Agreed.
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 12:21 pm
by m0skit0
Xian Nox wrote:Does this mean I cannot sell a computer if I have changed the hard drive for example? Or if I can't sell it if I have physically modified the hard drive?
Depends on the license applied on the system/hard drive.
Xian Nox wrote:Basically it's OK as long as the "victim" doesn't find out it's me.
But if it finds out, you can go to jail (no joking).
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:34 pm
by frank
m0skit0 wrote:Xian Nox wrote:Does this mean I cannot sell a computer if I have changed the hard drive for example? Or if I can't sell it if I have physically modified the hard drive?
Depends on the license applied on the system/hard drive.
thats why self built is the best! no licenses...i hope
all these laws are so stupid
you only get rights if ur a huge rich company
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 9:42 pm
by Xian Nox
frank wrote:thats why self built is the best! no licenses...i hope
Please give me a call when you build an Intel i7-2630QM equivalent CPU yourself.
Well, it is forbidden to sell modified hardware because it may no longer be safe to use. Imagine the following situation: you have a 10 000 RPM HDD and modify it to spin at 12 000 RPM. At least one of the components is not designed to work at that speed which would lead to a failure later on.
frank wrote:all these laws are so stupid
you only get rights if ur a huge rich company
Correct, but only to an extent.
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:24 am
by m0skit0
frank wrote:thats why self built is the best! no licenses...i hope
That doesn't avoid what I'm talking about. I'm talking about components themselves (hard disks, processors, memory, etc...).
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 2:23 pm
by frank
I meant putting components together.
They have licenses on stuff like the processer? O_o
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 7:51 pm
by m0skit0
frank wrote:They have licenses on stuff like the processer?
Of course
Re: Is keylogging your own computer illegal?
Posted: Fri Sep 23, 2011 10:55 pm
by Xian Nox
frank wrote:I meant putting components together.
They have licenses on stuff like the processer? O_o
I don't see anything wrong with assembling your own computer. It's not illegal to sell it afterward, or at least I don't see a reason why it should be.