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Android VS iOS

Everything related to smartphones and tablets that doesn't fit in the other forums
Llywelyn
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by Llywelyn » Thu Apr 05, 2012 6:57 pm

nisarg_kolhe wrote: lolwut? Ever been to XDA? :roll: There are like more than 10 active devs for every active device's sub-forum! And also, rooting is not everyone's piece of cake, but if you learn it, its fairly easy, and I never heard of an instance where anybody had to "wait" for his device's rooting capabilities, added that his device is fairly popular. But I've heard of news like the root was released before the release of the phone!(Latest Eg. HTC One X)

So 1 month is a lot of time to wait, if there is a popular device released, devs will work it to get it rooted, and some are very fast and we have root within week. Also it took a long time for iPhone 4S and iPad 2 to have a 5.1 jailbreak...

Yes I am even registered at XDA... :roll:
I think that you are not making the difference between a hacker and a developer: there are obviously a LOT (i'd even say too much) of devs making rom & stuff for Android devices, but VERY few that are actually finding exploits to root the phones.
Btw, they are not at XDA... (some exploits by c-skills.blogspot.com, others by the Android Exploid Team, unrEVOked, etc...).
I had to wait 6 months to get my Wildfire unlocked btw, and it was quite a popular device, trust me.

Oh, one last thing, iOS 5.1 is still not jailbroken (well... at least untethered).
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fouadtjuhmaster
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by fouadtjuhmaster » Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:28 pm

Xian Nox wrote:Moreover, the variety of devices Android can run on increases competition between manufacturers, and reduces prices, with the latter being to my liking.
Actualy that was what i ment to say :P
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m0skit0
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by m0skit0 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:58 pm

Llywelyn wrote:2. Quality: not saying that all Android devices are sh*t, but many of them are (including my HTC Wildfire, comes with cheap plastic, lower resolution LCD, etc...).
This allows people who can't afford iPhone-like quality to be able to use smartphones as well. Not everybody lives in first world countries (in fact very few people live in first world countries). This anyway has nothing to do with Android but with hardware manufacturers.
Llywelyn wrote:3. Design: that's my own opinion, but I have never such a beautiful phone as the iPhone
Personal taste and Apple marketing doing its job. Still nothing to do with iOS or Android...
Llywelyn wrote:4. Useful apps (95% of the Android Market is real garbage or clone of another app).
Define "useful". This is still your personal taste anyway.
Llywelyn wrote:5. Exclusivity for some apps / Apps are almost always released first for iOS.
Again, personal taste. I don't care about exclusivity or "released first". I don't mind waiting to get a piece of software, same as I don't care about fashion or "I'm the first to get/try this X".
Llywelyn wrote:6. The ease of jailbreaking your device
Llywelyn wrote:Oh, one last thing, iOS 5.1 is still not jailbroken (well... at least untethered).
:? :roll: :lol:
Llywelyn wrote:I have been an iOS user for 2007 to 2010 and I have been an Android user since (HTC Magic, Legend, Desire and Wildfire)
You really only had *** Android devices... How much each of those phones cost you, and how much iPhone cost you?

And Llywelyn, your answers/points just demonstrate that iOS users are just fashion-victims.
fouadtjuhmaster wrote:Actualy that was what i ment to say :P
:?: You simply make no sense, mate...
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Llywelyn
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by Llywelyn » Fri Apr 06, 2012 10:19 pm

m0skit0 wrote: This allows people who can't afford iPhone-like quality to be able to use smartphones as well. Not everybody lives in first world countries (in fact very few people live in first world countries). This anyway has nothing to do with Android but with hardware manufacturers.
I do agree with you, but still high end devices suffer from the availability to low end devices that makes it impossible to have both "heavy" Android versions that offer iOS ergonomy and quality to these high end devices, and makes still Android a slowish and buggish OS for low-end devices, such as mine. Even o/ced, my Wildfire was extremly slow with official 2.2 and still is with CM 2.3.7.
m0skit0 wrote:
Llywelyn wrote:3. Design: that's my own opinion, but I have never such a beautiful phone as the iPhone
Personal taste and Apple marketing doing its job. Still nothing to do with iOS or Android...
Please find a phone that is undoubtedly nicer than the iPhone (no cheap plastic (hey Samsung), sensible size, good quality components...). The "you are a brainwashed customer" argument is not an argument that I expected you to bring here... It actually usually starts a troll war, so I hope we stay away from this kind of arguments...
m0skit0 wrote:
Llywelyn wrote:4. Useful apps (95% of the Android Market is real garbage or clone of another app).
Define "useful". This is still your personal taste anyway.
Useful... Well it's my personal taste, but I find that a true GPS such as TomTom is much better than Talking Tom... Oh, btw, 90% of these "useful" apps don't run on my devices (that are 1 or 2 years old), so where's the point of getting an Android phone if you can't run the good apps on it ?
m0skit0 wrote:
Llywelyn wrote:5. Exclusivity for some apps / Apps are almost always released first for iOS.
Again, personal taste. I don't care about exclusivity or "released first". I don't mind waiting to get a piece of software, same as I don't care about fashion or "I'm the first to get/try this X".
Please do not misinterpret what I said. I do not care about "being the first to get X", but I do actually mind about "getting X on my phone". Do you really don't care about waiting 2 years an application on your device (such as Instagram, available on the AppStore since 2010) ? Please have an even-minded view of the problem...
m0skit0 wrote:
Llywelyn wrote:6. The ease of jailbreaking your device
Llywelyn wrote:Oh, one last thing, iOS 5.1 is still not jailbroken (well... at least untethered).

:? :roll: :lol:
What's the problem ? iOS 5.1 was released 1 month ago. Revolutionary (the last hack I heard of) was released in 2011, if I rememebr well... I bet one IRL pic that iOS users will get their jailbreak within one month !
m0skit0 wrote:
Llywelyn wrote:I have been an iOS user for 2007 to 2010 and I have been an Android user since (HTC Magic, Legend, Desire and Wildfire)
You really only had *** Android devices... How much each of those phones cost you, and how much iPhone cost you?
Thanks for my devices (few people actually called the HTC Desire ****, but maybe I can't afford what you'd be calling a good device). However, my iPhone 2G cost me ~50$ (I bought it bricked and unbricked it myself), bought my HTC Magic two years ago for 80$, my Legend for 100$ one year ago, my Desire 120$ 6 months ago and my Wildfire 80$ one month ago. I am a student, often short of money so I buy cheap phones and try to resell them months later to the same price, sometimes a bit more than I bought them, hence why I often changed my phone.
In the end, you see, I am not that billionaire fashion-victim that you thought iOS users were.
But in the other hand, I see that many Android users can be stubborn and one-sided... I really like Android, wouldn't be using it otherwise, but I am still clever enough to admit, from a customer point of view (and your arguments are often those of a dev... not the same thing, beware !), that iOS is a much more mature and convenient OS than Android is.

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m0skit0
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by m0skit0 » Sat Apr 07, 2012 3:14 am

Llywelyn wrote:I do agree with you, but still high end devices suffer from the availability to low end devices that makes it impossible to have both "heavy" Android versions that offer iOS ergonomy and quality to these high end devices, and makes still Android a slowish and buggish OS for low-end devices, such as mine. Even o/ced, my Wildfire was extremly slow with official 2.2 and still is with CM 2.3.7.
Of course. Did I say you would have same performance for half the price? Of course not. If you're paying less, you should expect less performance. If you want your Wildfire running fast, use previous Android versions. Also it's still not Android's fault if hardware manufacturers bundle Android versions too heavy for the device by default.
Llywelyn wrote:Please find a phone that is undoubtedly nicer than the iPhone
Again: "nicer" == personal taste. I'm not going to discuss this since to me, the iPhone is not even nice. And anyway it's something I don't care about.
Llywelyn wrote:The "you are a brainwashed customer" argument is not an argument that I expected you to bring here... It actually usually starts a troll war, so I hope we stay away from this kind of arguments...
I've never said you're brainwashed. All corporations do their marketing, and Apple does it very nice, that's a fact.
Llywelyn wrote:Oh, btw, 90% of these "useful" apps don't run on my devices (that are 1 or 2 years old), so where's the point of getting an Android phone if you can't run the good apps on it ?
My phone is one year old, and runs everything. If you get cheap devices, then expect to pay the price somewhere else, there's no magic. Also, does the iPhone 3 run everything on Apple Store?
Llywelyn wrote:but I do actually mind about "getting X on my phone"
"You cannot get everything" - rule of thumb in life. I'm pretty sure there are apps on Android that are not ported to iOS. This argument goes nowhere (same as Windows vs Linux discussion, btw).
Llywelyn wrote:Thanks for my devices (few people actually called the HTC Desire ****, but maybe I can't afford what you'd be calling a good device). However, my iPhone 2G cost me ~50$ (I bought it bricked and unbricked it myself), bought my HTC Magic two years ago for 80$, my Legend for 100$ one year ago, my Desire 120$ 6 months ago and my Wildfire 80$ one month ago. I am a student, often short of money so I buy cheap phones and try to resell them months later to the same price, sometimes a bit more than I bought them, hence why I often changed my phone.
Well, I'm happy you're this technically skilled, but I meant to compare the real retail prices of the devices. Most people cannot do what you did. And anyway, comparing the price of a bricked iPhone with non-bricked Android devices is simply unfair ;)
Llywelyn wrote:In the end, you see, I am not that billionaire fashion-victim that you thought iOS users were.
I know a lot of iOS users, and I know they're not billionaire fashion-victims (at least as seen when living in Europe...).
Llywelyn wrote:But in the other hand, I see that many Android users can be stubborn and one-sided... I really like Android, wouldn't be using it otherwise, but I am still clever enough to admit, from a customer point of view (and your arguments are often those of a dev... not the same thing, beware !), that iOS is a much more mature and convenient OS than Android is.
Depends on what that "customer" wants to do with the device. If you're a plain normal user, then any choice is good because both have pros and cons. But for a developer, iOS is way too closed and expensive. I have to get a Mac (i know there are third-party tools to develop on PC, but please, just go compare the IDE on Mac and on PC...), and pay Apple a fee just to debug on my physical device. Nonsense. Not to talk about learning a programming language that would be useless outside the Apple world. Absolute waste of time and money. No iOS, thanks.

PS: and btw, if you're so interested in making money, developing apps for mobile devices is a good way to get some bucks (or even a lot of them...).
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JJS
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by JJS » Sat Apr 07, 2012 7:05 am

It should also be noted that rooting your Android phone is much less important than jailbreaking an iPhone since you can install non-market applications out of the box on Android.

Besides that I really wonder why you downgraded from a Desire to a Wildfire. I got a Desire and it is pretty sweet if you ask me.

m0skit0 wrote:PS: and btw, if you're so interested in making money, developing apps for mobile devices is a good way to get some bucks (or even a lot of them...).
Yes, but: http://dilbert.com/2012-04-02/

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m0skit0
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by m0skit0 » Sat Apr 07, 2012 11:27 am

JJS wrote:Yes, but: http://dilbert.com/2012-04-02/
Well, we got one nobody has done yet (and we hope we can get it finished before anybody does :lol: ). It's a matter of ideas actually, as with everything

Btw, I had a Desire at well, but guys, it's way too cumbersome :lol:
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Llywelyn
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by Llywelyn » Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:21 pm

m0skit0 wrote:Of course. Did I say you would have same performance for half the price? Of course not. If you're paying less, you should expect less performance. If you want your Wildfire running fast, use previous Android versions.
I would have happily downgraded my phone to 1.6 to get it running smoothly. Unfortunately, no 1.6 version exists (as it was officially shipped with 2.2), and what's more if you have to tweak and root your phone to get it running properly, what's the point of buying it if you're not skilled enough to do so ?
m0skit0 wrote: I've never said you're brainwashed. All corporations do their marketing, and Apple does it very nice, that's a fact.
Maybe it's a fact, but I can assure you that I weigh very carefully the pros and the cons before buying a device...
m0skit0 wrote: My phone is one year old, and runs everything. If you get cheap devices, then expect to pay the price somewhere else, there's no magic. Also, does the iPhone 3 run everything on Apple Store?
The iPhone 3(G?) is 4 years old. At the moment, there is no application that can't be run by the 2-years old iPhone 4, and I bet that 99% are compatible with the 3-years old iPhone 3GS. A large share of applications are compatible with iOS 4.X and i'd even say that most of the apps can be run on iPhoneOS 3.X (and you can easily find alternatives with Whited00r firmwares).
Oh, actually, my Wildfire has a 528Mhz processor, and is overclocked to 710Mhz, what makes it actually faster than the iPhone 3GS processor...
m0skit0 wrote: "You cannot get everything" - rule of thumb in life. I'm pretty sure there are apps on Android that are not ported to iOS. This argument goes nowhere (same as Windows vs Linux discussion, btw).
I remember that discussion we had at daxhordes ! Have to reply actually... Anyway, the numbers are clearly in favour of iOS... More applications, hence more exclusivities. But you're right, let's leave this argument out of the discussion.
m0skit0 wrote: Well, I'm happy you're this technically skilled, but I meant to compare the real retail prices of the devices. Most people cannot do what you did. And anyway, comparing the price of a bricked iPhone with non-bricked Android devices is simply unfair ;)
I'm not that technically skilled, the people who coded the software I used are ;)
Anyway you can still find many iPhone 3G(S?) at very good prices, cheaper than most recent Android low-end devices.
m0skit0 wrote: And Llywelyn, your answers/points just demonstrate that iOS users are just fashion-victims.
m0skit0 wrote: I know a lot of iOS users, and I know they're not billionaire fashion-victims (at least as seen when living in Europe...).
That billionaire thing was stupid, but how about the fashion-victims ?
m0skit0 wrote: Depends on what that "customer" wants to do with the device. If you're a plain normal user, then any choice is good because both have pros and cons.
Happy to hear that ! I still think that an iPhone is better than any same-price Android device, but there are some good phones with an excellent quality/price rate (such as the ZTE Blade was).
m0skit0 wrote: But for a developer, iOS is way too closed and expensive. I have to get a Mac (i know there are third-party tools to develop on PC, but please, just go compare the IDE on Mac and on PC...), and pay Apple a fee just to debug on my physical device. Nonsense. Not to talk about learning a programming language that would be useless outside the Apple world. Absolute waste of time and money. No iOS, thanks.
You are probably right. I haven't ever developed for mobile environments, so I have no precise argument in favor of one or the other environments. But if you can make a lot of money by learning Objective-C, why not ? I mean, if you had to learn a specific language to make apps for Bada or Meego, okay, then I'd understand you, but Apple still holds a VERY large share of the smartphones market. It's like saying: "I won't learn how to use .NET API because you can only use it on Windows...".
JJS wrote:It should also be noted that rooting your Android phone is much less important than jailbreaking an iPhone since you can install non-market applications out of the box on Android.

Besides that I really wonder why you downgraded from a Desire to a Wildfire. I got a Desire and it is pretty sweet if you ask me.
It's mandatory to root your phone in order to use some (useful) apps and to change the ROM.
I had to sell my Desire because I had an urgent need of money. When money doesn't flow out, you have to find the cash anyway...
Btw, the Desire was too big for me. The Wildfire is too small. A phone like the iPhone or the Legend was just what I needed.

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m0skit0
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by m0skit0 » Sat Apr 07, 2012 5:33 pm

Llywelyn wrote:and what's more if you have to tweak and root your phone to get it running properly, what's the point of buying it if you're not skilled enough to do so ?
Why are you asking me? I didn't buy it. You did. This is not Apple: you have to choose carefully your hardware. Same goes for PC vs Mac. But this gives you a wider choice and, more importanly, you don't get locked by any stupid corporation.
Llywelyn wrote:there is no application that can't be run by the 2-years old iPhone 4
1.5 years. I can run anything on Android Market on my HTC Inspire as well, which was released shortly after the iPhone 4.
Llywelyn wrote:A large share of applications are compatible with iOS 4.X and i'd even say that most of the apps can be run on iPhoneOS 3.X
Going back to your arguments: but what if I want X and X doesn't run?
Llywelyn wrote:and you can easily find alternatives with Whited00r firmwares
Llywelyn wrote:if you have to tweak and root your phone to get it running properly, what's the point of buying it if you're not skilled enough to do so ?
Llywelyn wrote:Oh, actually, my Wildfire has a 528Mhz processor, and is overclocked to 710Mhz, what makes it actually faster than the iPhone 3GS processor...
So? :roll:
Llywelyn wrote:the numbers are clearly in favour of iOS... More applications, hence more exclusivities
Quantity != quality. And anyway, Android is growing faster

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Llywelyn wrote:Anyway you can still find many iPhone 3G(S?) at very good prices, cheaper than most recent Android low-end devices.
Just quoting this to demonstrate that most iPhone (Apple) users are fashion-victims: there are so many second hand old iPhone models at good prices because the ones who bought it doesn't feel "fashion" enough with old models.
Llywelyn wrote:That billionaire thing was stupid, but how about the fashion-victims ?
I never said ALL of them, but most (90+%) are. In fact all the ones I know personally are. One discussion I had with a workmate (a programmer):

[spoiler]She: "I'm going to buy the iPad 2"
Me: "I don't like tablets, but did you check other ones?"
She: "Nope"
Me: "You should"
She: "Nope"
Me: "Why not?"
She: "I want the iPad 2"
Me: "Does it play Flash?"
She: "I don't know"
Me: "Does it have standard USB plug?"
She: "I don't know"
Me: "But did you check the specs?"
She: "Nope"
Me: "Then how do you know you want that tablet and not another one?"
She: "Because I just want it"[/spoiler]

This demonstrates how all Apple users I personally know are. And also (coincidence?) all of them lack any decent technical ablities/knowledge.
Llywelyn wrote:Happy to hear that ! I still think that an iPhone is better than any same-price Android device, but there are some good phones with an excellent quality/price rate (such as the ZTE Blade was).
Good, but the iPhone has a terrible quality/price rate, probably worst of all devices in the market. Also may I suggest you check this videos.
Llywelyn wrote:But if you can make a lot of money by learning Objective-C, why not ?
If you're going to make a lot of money, you can do it for Android anyway, and learn Java, which is way more useful and also a more modern programming language that is platform independent.
Llywelyn wrote:It's like saying: "I won't learn how to use .NET API because you can only use it on Windows...".
Bad comparison. .NET API can be used on other systems. And anyway, .Net is also platform independent (you dont have to rewrite your code for a different architecture).

I also forgot to mention that Apple devices run code you don't know about. Recently it was discovered that Apple logs a lot of your personal information, only they know what they do with it. If you appreciate your privacy, you won't run closed code on such a personal device such as a phone. Fortunately on Android devices you can install custom ROMs where the code is all available and worked by a community. On iOS devices, you only get jailbreak, but still have to rely on Apple's closed code. Which is, btw, why you get hacks faster for iOS devices.

And also, iPhone customization sucks very hard. Why can't I have widgets on the desktop? Why can't I choose another desktop look, effects...? I don't know if jailbroken you can do that, but on Android devices you don't need to root for such a trivial customization thing. This really sucks since I do want to be able to customize my device, because the way it comes never works nice for me. I would just hate an iOS device, for sure.

Oh and also, I discovered the other day that Bluetooth on Apple devices only works with other Apple devices... Very sad... :lol:

EDIT: oh, I just found out that Apple Store has no refund policy... Nice job again.

EDIT2: this gets scary: http://www.latimes.com/business/technol ... 2566.story
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Finei7
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Re: Android VS iOS

Post by Finei7 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:34 pm

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Last edited by JJS on Tue Apr 10, 2012 4:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Instead of removing the post of this spammer altogether I only deleted the link because I find it kinda hilarious

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