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#77607 by ultimakillz
Sat Jun 11, 2011 12:25 am
blubswillrule wrote:It is said that the source be available upon request, and the source (the engine source) has not been requested until now

if you dont mind my asking, what says that?
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#77674 by wololo
Sat Jun 11, 2011 7:41 am
ultimakillz wrote:
blubswillrule wrote:It is said that the source be available upon request, and the source (the engine source) has not been requested until now

if you dont mind my asking, what says that?

Well, as far as we know, the first request was made on june 7th (4 days ago), I don't think we saw any other such request before.

Mobster wrote:I will also continue trying to contact him, but please be lenient towards us. It is completely out of our control whether the source is put up in the designated time frame, but please note that we are making it our utmost priority. Hopefully Jukki will respond and at least let the team and community know that he understands the situation.

You might find some people's reaction going "over the top" here, but people like m0skit0 and myself have seen too many people blatantly infringing the GPL on some of our own projects, so it's kind of a sensitive issue here. We also know that in most cases, the problem is not to get the source (people always provide it eventually because they can't afford to go to court), but to get it in a timely manner. Also the fact that you (or your mods) simply locked such a request on your forum shows that you are not "genuinely" unaware of the issue, which doesn't help your case.

That being said I don't want to be remembered as the guy who disqualified one of the best entries of this contest, and I can confirm that Jukki does not connect very often here. I agree that reaching him on a weekend might be hard. Please do your best to reach him, I'm ready to wait until early next week for the source to be updated.

Also, in the future, you should always proactively provide the source rather than wait for somebody to ask for it. I know that legally you're not doing anything wrong, but the only thing you achieve is *** a bunch of people.

Again, to clear up any misunderstanding, what is requested here is your modified source of proquake, not the source for qc.
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#77709 by Lartza
Sat Jun 11, 2011 11:40 am
Wololo wrote:
ultimakillz wrote:
blubswillrule wrote:It is said that the source be available upon request, and the source (the engine source) has not been requested until now

if you dont mind my asking, what says that?

Well, as far as we know, the first request was made on june 7th (4 days ago), I don't think we saw any other such request before.


Yea but the request doesn't matter in a way since the binaries should come with a txt file containing the GPL license and the source SHOULD be shipped with the binary or be available separately in the first place. But I get the logic where one would release the source after a request.
#77781 by ultimakillz
Sat Jun 11, 2011 5:04 pm
Lartza wrote:Yea but the request doesn't matter in a way since the binaries should come with a txt file containing the GPL license and the source SHOULD be shipped with the binary or be available separately in the first place. But I get the logic where one would release the source after a request.

yes, thats what i ment. i was unaware that you could withhold the source until someone requested it under the gpl. i thought the source had to be included in the release.

http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.htm ... stedPublic
#77962 by m0skit0
Sun Jun 12, 2011 3:21 pm
blubswillrule wrote:It is said that the source be available upon request

Can you link me please?

blubswillrule wrote:the source (the engine source) has not been requested until now

What do you mean by "now"? Lartza the request the source on June 07.

blubswillrule wrote:the problem with that is the ONLY person that has the source is Jukki

So you're one of the developers, but you don't have the source code?

blubswillrule wrote:That 48 hour deadline is looking quite grim seeing as Jukki isn't coming back for another week or so.

There should be no deadline in fact. You already refused to release the source code when asked for it, and it's your responsibility to provide the source code when publicly releasing the binaries.

Mobster wrote:It is completely out of our control whether the source is put up in the designated time frame

Then Jukki should have put a download to the sources when he released the binaries. Plain simple. In fact it's not our problem you didn't comply with GPL. Next time please take your time and read the licenses of the software you use.

You guys are acting quite strange and with too much excuses. Anyway, you guys are lucky Wololo is so nice and diplomatic.
#78009 by Mobster
Sun Jun 12, 2011 6:59 pm
Please try to understand the situation rather than focus on finding our faults. There is one lead developer who has the source code and only he can provide you with it. He decided to keep the source for himself until the release because we have had leaking problems in the past. Our "too many excuses" are quite realistic and not too numerable as you keep stating. The source was asked for and we do therefore have to give it up, I am aware. However, it was only requested at a time when the developer that does have it was leaving for vacation. It doesn't seem like a fishy story to me, but rather a predicament that can be easily resolved if you keep your patience and give us time. I will let you know as soon as I can make contact with Jukki. Until then we have nothing more to say and I hope that goes for you too.
#78012 by m0skit0
Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:39 pm
Mobster wrote:Please try to understand the situation rather than focus on finding our faults.

You put yourselves in this situation. It's your sole responsibility. And yes, they're excuses because you (and him) knew you had to release the sources and didn't do it, even when asked to. You ask me to understand when you guys locked that thread of a user requesting his rights. Quite funny. Anyway, I'm done with this discussion until the deadline.
#78014 by jastolze
Sun Jun 12, 2011 7:52 pm
Mobster's right. Lartza didn't request the source code until Jukki left. In fact, Jukki hasn't even logged on since June 1st, and Lartza didn't ask for it until a couple of days later. Lartza went through all of this trouble (ie: posting screenshots of our website, researching the GPL License) just to take us down. He's going to get the source code... either when Jukki comes back, or if we happen to get the source from him while he's enjoying himself on vacation. Either way, he WILL receive it. He just needs to be patient.

P.S: JUKKI IS THE ONLY ONE WITH THE SOURCE. Meaning, like I said above, It wasn't available at the time. Lartza is the FIRST person to have asked for the source. So, The team did not need to release it until that time, which is inconvenient for us.
#78023 by ultimakillz
Sun Jun 12, 2011 8:23 pm
again, im not sure why the fact that no one requested the source until now is a valid argument. from my understanding of the gpl the source must be included when the product was released, regardless if it was requested or not. am i missing something here?

the response to Lartza's thread on the project's home forum make me believe that releasing the source was never part of the plan, and now that you guys have been called out on it you are trying cover your ***. again, just my opinion.
#78025 by jastolze
Sun Jun 12, 2011 8:32 pm
Because no one did request it until just now, and from what I understand, It doesn't need to be released along with the package. Besides, I've downloaded quite a few old quake 1 mods that don't have the source code included. Instead, it says: "If you want it, email or PM me for it".

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